Untapped Potential - T-Virus Infected Las Plagas

Moonknight67

Nite, weren't you saying that the lickers and some of the other creatures like the hunters WEREN'T B.O.W.s because they were mindless, uncontrollable beasts?

_________________

"The death cannot die." -HUNK
"Without power, you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself." -Vergil

NiteKrawler

Moonknight67 wrote:

Nite, weren't you saying that the lickers and some of the other creatures like the hunters WEREN'T B.O.W.s because they were mindless, uncontrollable beasts?

No. I said lickers were not and zombies were not. And they aren't. Hunters are. Cerberus, Neptune, the Tyrant, the Chimeras, etc. all were. Personally, I think the Tyrant is the only one that could really be considered a weapon, but Umbrella made the others specifically as BOWs. The zombies and lickers were an accident. But if they call Cerberus a weapon, they may as well call zombies one too.

_________________
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Wesker is officially dead: http://ps3.ign.com/articles/100/1006931p1.html

NiteKrawler wrote:

Jamesy wrote:

Fine you win NightCrawler

YYYYYEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOOOOOHOOOO!!!!!! Who's up for round 2!?!?!?!?!?!?

Moonknight67

NiteKrawler wrote:

No. I said lickers were not and zombies were not. And they aren't. Hunters are. Cerberus, Neptune, the Tyrant, the Chimeras, etc. all were. Personally, I think the Tyrant is the only one that could really be considered a weapon, but Umbrella made the others specifically as BOWs. The zombies and lickers were an accident. But if they call Cerberus a weapon, they may as well call zombies one too.

I really think the Tyrants are the only real B.O.W.s made by Umbrella.
Whether Umbrella intended for the rest of them to be B.O.W.s is irrelevant in my opinion, as in my opinion B.O.W.s should be like any other real weapon used today, i.e. a gun, bomb, missile or something else. Definition - Controllable. a useable tool to kill another living thing. That's a weapon in my opinion.

In fact : The definition of weapon: "any instrument or device for use in attack or defense in combat, fighting, or war, as a sword, rifle, or cannon."

An instrument must be a useable item, not a mindless beast. You wouldn't use a gun that fired randomly, or a sword that would randomly turn on you.

_________________

"The death cannot die." -HUNK
"Without power, you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself." -Vergil

NiteKrawler

^ Agreed.

_________________
Leon Fanboys Please Click Here

Wesker is officially dead: http://ps3.ign.com/articles/100/1006931p1.html

NiteKrawler wrote:

Jamesy wrote:

Fine you win NightCrawler

YYYYYEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOOOOOHOOOO!!!!!! Who's up for round 2!?!?!?!?!?!?

Moonknight67

Let it be known that NiteKrawler agreed with me. Very Happy

_________________

"The death cannot die." -HUNK
"Without power, you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself." -Vergil

Spike991

Moonknight67 wrote:

NiteKrawler wrote:

No. I said lickers were not and zombies were not. And they aren't. Hunters are. Cerberus, Neptune, the Tyrant, the Chimeras, etc. all were. Personally, I think the Tyrant is the only one that could really be considered a weapon, but Umbrella made the others specifically as BOWs. The zombies and lickers were an accident. But if they call Cerberus a weapon, they may as well call zombies one too.

I really think the Tyrants are the only real B.O.W.s made by Umbrella.
Whether Umbrella intended for the rest of them to be B.O.W.s is irrelevant in my opinion, as in my opinion B.O.W.s should be like any other real weapon used today, i.e. a gun, bomb, missile or something else. Definition - Controllable. a useable tool to kill another living thing. That's a weapon in my opinion.

In fact : The definition of weapon: "any instrument or device for use in attack or defense in combat, fighting, or war, as a sword, rifle, or cannon."

An instrument must be a useable item, not a mindless beast. You wouldn't use a gun that fired randomly, or a sword that would randomly turn on you.

Cerberus weren't an accident, they were in the report about BOWs, remember from the REmake?

Aren't Hunters, Cerberus, Bandersnatches, and pretty much every enemy an "instrument or device for use in attack"?

Opinions aside, the fact is that all of the bio-weapons seen throughout the games are BOWs.

_________________
"The ultimate lifeform...Tyrant", Albert Wesker, REmake
"It's sheer perfection...My precious G-Virus", William Birkin, RE2
Consumer Recreation Services

Flippy147

Spike991 wrote:

Cerberus weren't an accident, they were in the report about BOWs, remember from the REmake?

Aren't Hunters, Cerberus, Bandersnatches, and pretty much every enemy an "instrument or device for use in attack"?

Opinions aside, the fact is that all of the bio-weapons seen throughout the games are BOWs.

This is my point, what's the point of making these abominations, if they were not supposed to be used as weapons?
They have no other purpose.

Moonknight67

Spike991 wrote:

Cerberus weren't an accident, they were in the report about BOWs, remember from the REmake?

Aren't Hunters, Cerberus, Bandersnatches, and pretty much every enemy an "instrument or device for use in attack"?

Opinions aside, the fact is that all of the bio-weapons seen throughout the games are BOWs.

In my opinion, the only B.O.W.s are the ones with controllability, ones that can be used with intent with absolutely no possibility of something going wrong. You wouldn't use a faulty gun, or a broken sword.

An "Instrument or device for use in attack" is an item which can be used as intended to cause harm to another. If it can't be contorolled, it's not really a weapon, in my opinion. Umbrella may have intended for Cerberii, Hunters, etc. to be B.O.W.s, but personally I think they failed in making any effective B.O.W.s until the Tyrant.

_________________

"The death cannot die." -HUNK
"Without power, you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself." -Vergil

Spike991

Moonknight67 wrote:

Spike991 wrote:

Cerberus weren't an accident, they were in the report about BOWs, remember from the REmake?

Aren't Hunters, Cerberus, Bandersnatches, and pretty much every enemy an "instrument or device for use in attack"?

Opinions aside, the fact is that all of the bio-weapons seen throughout the games are BOWs.

In my opinion, the only B.O.W.s are the ones with controllability, ones that can be used with intent with absolutely no possibility of something going wrong. You wouldn't use a faulty gun, or a broken sword.

An "Instrument or device for use in attack" is an item which can be used as intended to cause harm to another. If it can't be contorolled, it's not really a weapon, in my opinion. Umbrella may have intended for Cerberii, Hunters, etc. to be B.O.W.s, but personally I think they failed in making any effective B.O.W.s until the Tyrant.

Well then there is a flaw in your opinion, as no BOW is totally capable of being controlled. The Tyrants aren't even that perfect.

The Proto-Tyrant, the T-002, Thanatos, the T-091, Pluto, among others are Tyrants that weren't controllable. The T-0400tp from Outbreak File#2 is notorious for being programmed for one thing, then rebelling against it's master, as seen in the End Of The Road scenario.

Furthermore, the "Sweeper"(I believe that was the name), a Hunter that was seen in CVX, which was used with the robots that would spot you, then alert the Hunter to your position, allowing for a controlled attack.

Nemesis was basically a T-103, just like Mr.X, but with the Nemesis parasite, and that one was given orders(killing the STARS members), and even had the intelligence to speak(saying "STARS", among other growls), but even Nemesis was unstable.

_________________
"The ultimate lifeform...Tyrant", Albert Wesker, REmake
"It's sheer perfection...My precious G-Virus", William Birkin, RE2
Consumer Recreation Services

Moonknight67

Spike991 wrote:

Well then there is a flaw in your opinion, as no BOW is totally capable of being controlled. The Tyrants aren't even that perfect.

The Proto-Tyrant, the T-002, Thanatos, the T-091, Pluto, among others are Tyrants that weren't controllable. The T-0400tp from Outbreak File#2 is notorious for being programmed for one thing, then rebelling against it's master, as seen in the End Of The Road scenario.

Furthermore, the "Sweeper"(I believe that was the name), a Hunter that was seen in CVX, which was used with the robots that would spot you, then alert the Hunter to your position, allowing for a controlled attack.

Nemesis was basically a T-103, just like Mr.X, but with the Nemesis parasite, and that one was given orders(killing the STARS members), and even had the intelligence to speak(saying "STARS", among other growls), but even Nemesis was unstable.

I guess the "Sweeper" could count as an efficient way of making Hunters B.O.W.s, but they'd have to be used in combination, a Hunter on its own is far from an effective Bio-Weapon.

As for the Tyrants, no weapon is perfect, and some are bound to have flaws in their theory and implementation (guns may jam or break, missiles or rockets my go off-target or explode at wrong times), but as long as they can normally be used properly and controlled in a way to do what is intended of them, they can be considered weapons.

The Proto-Tyrant, and pretty much every Tyrant prior to the T-103 were more tests than actual weapons. Like the ancient Chinese using explosive powder to perfect the bomb, you must have prototypes to perfect the design of the Tyrant. They could all be considered, I suppose, B.O.W. Prototypes, but not until T-103 was the Tyrant truly a Bio-Organic Weapon. At least, not a controllable, effective one. Which is the only type I'd really consider a B.O.W.

_________________

"The death cannot die." -HUNK
"Without power, you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself." -Vergil

NiteKrawler

I never said Cerberus was an accident. I know the BOW slideshow you are talking about perfectly. What I have been saying all along here is that the zombies are not BOWs. They were an accident. They are BOAs. Bio-Organic Accidents. Therefore, the lickers are as well.

_________________
Leon Fanboys Please Click Here

Wesker is officially dead: http://ps3.ign.com/articles/100/1006931p1.html

NiteKrawler wrote:

Jamesy wrote:

Fine you win NightCrawler

YYYYYEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOOOOOHOOOO!!!!!! Who's up for round 2!?!?!?!?!?!?

Spike991

Moonknight67 wrote:

Spike991 wrote:

Well then there is a flaw in your opinion, as no BOW is totally capable of being controlled. The Tyrants aren't even that perfect.

The Proto-Tyrant, the T-002, Thanatos, the T-091, Pluto, among others are Tyrants that weren't controllable. The T-0400tp from Outbreak File#2 is notorious for being programmed for one thing, then rebelling against it's master, as seen in the End Of The Road scenario.

Furthermore, the "Sweeper"(I believe that was the name), a Hunter that was seen in CVX, which was used with the robots that would spot you, then alert the Hunter to your position, allowing for a controlled attack.

Nemesis was basically a T-103, just like Mr.X, but with the Nemesis parasite, and that one was given orders(killing the STARS members), and even had the intelligence to speak(saying "STARS", among other growls), but even Nemesis was unstable.

I guess the "Sweeper" could count as an efficient way of making Hunters B.O.W.s, but they'd have to be used in combination, a Hunter on its own is far from an effective Bio-Weapon.

As for the Tyrants, no weapon is perfect, and some are bound to have flaws in their theory and implementation (guns may jam or break, missiles or rockets my go off-target or explode at wrong times), but as long as they can normally be used properly and controlled in a way to do what is intended of them, they can be considered weapons.

The Proto-Tyrant, and pretty much every Tyrant prior to the T-103 were more tests than actual weapons. Like the ancient Chinese using explosive powder to perfect the bomb, you must have prototypes to perfect the design of the Tyrant. They could all be considered, I suppose, B.O.W. Prototypes, but not until T-103 was the Tyrant truly a Bio-Organic Weapon. At least, not a controllable, effective one. Which is the only type I'd really consider a B.O.W.

That sounds a bit hypocritical, you are saying the Tyrant's flaws, it's lack of control for instance, is like how "no weapon is perfect", while the same could be used for a Hunter, or any other.

"Weapons are only so good in as much as you use them", I believe that was Carter from Outbreak File#2, regarding the T-0400tp used against the Hunter R's.

"but as long as they can normally be used properly and controlled in a way to do what is intended of them, they can be considered weapons", that one is your quote, well using a Hunter, or even zombies, much like what was seen in Degeneration in the Harvardville airport terminal, they were used properly in a terrorist attack, they did what was intended, and that could be considered a weapon.

BOW is not a term that is exclusive to the Tyrants.

@Nite, I know you have played the REmake, so I knew you got that referrence, but I am saying that Tyrants are not the only ones that can or should be labeled BOWs.

Even zombies, which are undeniably accidents, can be used as weapons.

_________________
"The ultimate lifeform...Tyrant", Albert Wesker, REmake
"It's sheer perfection...My precious G-Virus", William Birkin, RE2
Consumer Recreation Services

NiteKrawler

Sure they can be used as weapons. But they aren't classified as BOWs by Umbrella because technically, they shouldn't exist. Also, you can really turn anything into a weapon. Chris Brown likes to use his fists against beautiful singers, Russel Crowe uses telephones as a "deadly weapon", and apparently Pat Benatar met some dude that liked to use sex as a weapon. This doesn't mean that hands, telephones, and sex are weapons though.

_________________
Leon Fanboys Please Click Here

Wesker is officially dead: http://ps3.ign.com/articles/100/1006931p1.html

NiteKrawler wrote:

Jamesy wrote:

Fine you win NightCrawler

YYYYYEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOOOOOHOOOO!!!!!! Who's up for round 2!?!?!?!?!?!?

Moonknight67

Spike991 wrote:

That sounds a bit hypocritical, you are saying the Tyrant's flaws, it's lack of control for instance, is like how "no weapon is perfect", while the same could be used for a Hunter, or any other.

"Weapons are only so good in as much as you use them", I believe that was Carter from Outbreak File#2, regarding the T-0400tp used against the Hunter R's.

"but as long as they can normally be used properly and controlled in a way to do what is intended of them, they can be considered weapons", that one is your quote, well using a Hunter, or even zombies, much like what was seen in Degeneration in the Harvardville airport terminal, they were used properly in a terrorist attack, they did what was intended, and that could be considered a weapon.

BOW is not a term that is exclusive to the Tyrants.

@Nite, I know you have played the REmake, so I knew you got that referrence, but I am saying that Tyrants are not the only ones that can or should be labeled BOWs.

Even zombies, which are undeniably accidents, can be used as weapons.

NiteKrawler wrote:

Sure they can be used as weapons. But they aren't classified as BOWs by Umbrella because technically, they shouldn't exist. Also, you can really turn anything into a weapon. Chris Brown likes to use his fists against beautiful singers, Russel Crowe uses telephones as a "deadly weapon", and apparently Pat Benatar met some dude that liked to use sex as a weapon. This doesn't mean that hands, telephones, and sex are weapons though.

I agree with NiteKrawler's last note, not anything that can be used to hurt someone or considered by one person to be a weapon IS in fact a weapon. I have a more specific definition of weapon, and in my opinion a Bio-Organic Weapon is a living biologically modified organism that is used as a tool to accomplish a means to cause harm or destruction. Lickers, Hunters (without the Sweepers) and the earlier Tyrant types weren't effective B.O.W.s, because they couldn't be used as tools. Tools are items used specifically to accomplish a purpose while doing nothing more or less. Zombies, or Lickers are more of a "point them in a direction and hope they don't turn around" type of thing. They can't really be used so much as set loose. But that's just my opinion.

_________________

"The death cannot die." -HUNK
"Without power, you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself." -Vergil

Spike991

Moonknight67 wrote:

Spike991 wrote:

That sounds a bit hypocritical, you are saying the Tyrant's flaws, it's lack of control for instance, is like how "no weapon is perfect", while the same could be used for a Hunter, or any other.

"Weapons are only so good in as much as you use them", I believe that was Carter from Outbreak File#2, regarding the T-0400tp used against the Hunter R's.

"but as long as they can normally be used properly and controlled in a way to do what is intended of them, they can be considered weapons", that one is your quote, well using a Hunter, or even zombies, much like what was seen in Degeneration in the Harvardville airport terminal, they were used properly in a terrorist attack, they did what was intended, and that could be considered a weapon.

BOW is not a term that is exclusive to the Tyrants.

@Nite, I know you have played the REmake, so I knew you got that referrence, but I am saying that Tyrants are not the only ones that can or should be labeled BOWs.

Even zombies, which are undeniably accidents, can be used as weapons.

NiteKrawler wrote:

Sure they can be used as weapons. But they aren't classified as BOWs by Umbrella because technically, they shouldn't exist. Also, you can really turn anything into a weapon. Chris Brown likes to use his fists against beautiful singers, Russel Crowe uses telephones as a "deadly weapon", and apparently Pat Benatar met some dude that liked to use sex as a weapon. This doesn't mean that hands, telephones, and sex are weapons though.

I agree with NiteKrawler's last note, not anything that can be used to hurt someone or considered by one person to be a weapon IS in fact a weapon. I have a more specific definition of weapon, and in my opinion a Bio-Organic Weapon is a living biologically modified organism that is used as a tool to accomplish a means to cause harm or destruction. Lickers, Hunters (without the Sweepers) and the earlier Tyrant types weren't effective B.O.W.s, because they couldn't be used as tools. Tools are items used specifically to accomplish a purpose while doing nothing more or less. Zombies, or Lickers are more of a "point them in a direction and hope they don't turn around" type of thing. They can't really be used so much as set loose. But that's just my opinion.

Anything can be used as a weapon. And well, we aren't talking about anything or everything, we are talking about other RE enemies, which are for some odd reason, being ommitted from the BOW label, when they are in fact, Bio-Organic Weapons.

Zombies are not weapons, but can be utilized as such, as I have used examples, and Degeneration is a prime example.

The only enemy that is a BOW, by your logic, is TALOS(Tyrant-Lethal Organic System), as it is the only one that could be controlled, which was by the Red Queen, and it was an effective weapon in how it could take damage as well as utilize weapons, such as a rocket launcher.

Aren't Hunters, Chimera, etc, "living biologically modified" organisms? They were made to be Bio-weapons. documents in RE0 go into details about how some of the enemies that you encounter in that particular game are or are not effective bio-weapons.

_________________
"The ultimate lifeform...Tyrant", Albert Wesker, REmake
"It's sheer perfection...My precious G-Virus", William Birkin, RE2
Consumer Recreation Services